October 8th, 2008
In Training: England’s Midfield
Who would you put in the midfield for England’s game against Kazakhstan this weekend, Kickettes?
Do you believe in the Gerrard/Lampsy combo? Should Becks stay on the bench? What about good ol’ Gareth Barry and the return of Shaun Wright-Phillips?
And is it just us, or are you equally fascinated by the ‘thumbs up’ v ‘thumbs tucked’ jogging style of the boys?
image via ZUMAPRESS/KEYSTONE Press
as much as i lust over Becks, sorry, no. and it pains me to say that. however, the Gerrard-Lamps convination should work, and lets hope it does. they're both amazing players but they do clash when they play alongside. hopefully, Capello has been working on improving this and it will work. thumbs up, please. sorry Becks, again.
Gerrard and Lampard certainly can work together (2004 European championships are an example) but like a lie that is told so often that it somehow becomes a truth, this myth has been born that two world-class midfielders can’t share a pitch. The truth is that both players are phenomenal for their teams, and somehow we expect them to repeat that as a duo for their country without putting in the time to make it happen. Like Frank said yesterday, neither Sven or Steve M. ever spent time with Frank and Steven discussing exactly *how* to make it work. Now Capello is putting in the time, talking tactics and explaining what he wants (i.e. double session today). We’ll see if that helps. To quote Frank yesterday, “It should work. I don’t think we are stupid players and I don’t think we are egotistical."
Frank is in the form of his life at the moment, whereas Steven is a bit quiet at the moment at club level, but I think Steven is a better motivator of men when the pressure is on. Ideally, you’d want both on your team.
THe basic problem with Gerrard is that he is an extremely undisciplined player, who likes to wonder-around and get get involed. Someone called him a formation killer and that is true, he is. He can't stay in his position. Because of that tied with his inablity to pass effectively, he loses his marks and the ball a lot. Someone on his team has to spend the game cleaning up his messes which takes the game down to 10 men. Lampard is a much more disciplined player and plays much better in a squad. He is a much more of an effective team player, Gerrard is much more of an effective individual player. Gerrard is a better tackler but has to be because he loses his marks a lot and then has to go get them. Barry and Lampard worked much because they played as part of the team and played their own positions and were responsible for their own messes. For a year, I had been championing the B-G midfield because their skills balanced well together. THe other thing is that Lampard gives you a much more impressive scoring option. If Heskey is out and there is a lack of pure scores on the bench you need Lampard is the form of his life. I found this on an opinion blog.. [Gerrard's form for] Liverpool and then compare it to his England record. 13 goals in total – none at Euro 2004, two at Germany 2006 – only to miss a penalty in the shoot-out with Portugal, and then captain of England for the defeats against Russia and Croatia that ended Steve McClaren's reign. 13 goals at a rate of one every five games – the majority against the international minnows (3 against Andorra, 1 against Trinidad, 1 against Azerbaijan, 1 against Austria, 1 against Macedonia). If you discount strikes against Andorra, Gerrard's last competitive strike for England was in June 2006 against Sweden. Whereas Lampard seems to raise his game internationally; only one more goal from three fewer caps – but goals when it matters. Goals against France, Croatia and Portugal (plus a penalty shoot-out strike) in Euro 2004; none of England's six goals in Germany 2006 – but 5 in the qualifying group; plus a goal against Croatia in the abortive 2008 qualifying campaign. Lampard scores the majority of his goals in high pressure tournament or qualifying, not in friendlies or routs. If they can't play together, Lampard is on form for both club and country, he is links up better with the entire team. Gerrard is scoring goals bu not necessaily in great form. He has gone AWOL in a lot of game, popping up only for a minute here or there.Source
JT is out for Sat
JT is out for Sat
I love love love Becks but I agree that Gerrard-Lampard is probably the best midfield option. Frankie should definitely not be dropped – everything you said is true JB. Re thumbs up/tucked – I’m thumbs tucked every time Becks style!
With all due respect, I do believe Lampard and Gerrard can play together. However, if one were to be dropped and the other linked with Barry….Lampard is the only one who has played well with Barry. Lamps doesn’t hold Stevie G back, Stevie G holds himself back. Earlier this year, Lamps had an injury spell, and so Stevie G was left on his own with Barry….we lost….terribly…more than once. But when Gerrard was injured, Lamps shone with Barry.
THe basic problem with Gerrard is that he is an extremely undisciplined player, who likes to wonder-around and get get involed. Someone called him a formation killer and that is true, he is. He can’t stay in his position.
Because of that tied with his inablity to pass effectively, he loses his marks and the ball a lot. Someone on his team has to spend the game cleaning up his messes which takes the game down to 10 men.
Lampard is a much more disciplined player and plays much better in a squad. He is a much more of an effective team player, Gerrard is much more of an effective individual player. Gerrard is a better tackler but has to be because he loses his marks a lot and then has to go get them.
Barry and Lampard worked much because they played as part of the team and played their own positions and were responsible for their own messes. For a year, I had been championing the B-G midfield because their skills balanced well together.
THe other thing is that Lampard gives you a much more impressive scoring option. If Heskey is out and there is a lack of pure scores on the bench you need Lampard is the form of his life. I found this on an opinion blog..
[Gerrard's form for] Liverpool and then compare it to his England record. 13 goals in total – none at Euro 2004, two at Germany 2006 – only to miss a penalty in the shoot-out with Portugal, and then captain of England for the defeats against Russia and Croatia that ended Steve McClaren’s reign. 13 goals at a rate of one every five games – the majority against the international minnows (3 against Andorra, 1 against Trinidad, 1 against Azerbaijan, 1 against Austria, 1 against Macedonia). If you discount strikes against Andorra, Gerrard’s last competitive strike for England was in June 2006 against Sweden.
Whereas Lampard seems to raise his game internationally; only one more goal from three fewer caps – but goals when it matters. Goals against France, Croatia and Portugal (plus a penalty shoot-out strike) in Euro 2004; none of England’s six goals in Germany 2006 – but 5 in the qualifying group; plus a goal against Croatia in the abortive 2008 qualifying campaign. Lampard scores the majority of his goals in high pressure tournament or qualifying, not in friendlies or routs.
If they can’t play together, Lampard is on form for both club and country, he is links up better with the entire team. Gerrard is scoring goals bu not necessaily in great form. He has gone AWOL in a lot of game, popping up only for a minute here or there.
Source
Frank and Gerrard are both two AMAZING midfielders, but they clash when together. I’m with LTG – they need to work out the kinks with each other. On another note, I’m super aggravated that I had to give up tickets to that match to take the SAT. Ugh.
Okay this is weird. I mentioned that very thumbs up thing in the England thread yesterday. Great minds, eh?
Miss Hargreaves OBVIOUSLY and Carrick. My opinions on the mid-field as it stands currently, I certainly hope that Frank and Stevie can work out the kinks and get down to business – set up goals, score goals. Get over yourselves and just do it.
lose that girl blog
I’m really upsad to coach Don Fabio.<img src="http://www.kickette.com/images/smileys/hmm.gif" width="19" height="19" alt="hmmm" style="border:0;" />
Why must Michael Owen became the “victim” on this game?:ohh:
Are he bad? I think that is non sense.
I Love England and I love Owen too.
Maybe its time for Owen to work hard for that position.
and I guess Lampsy and Stevie could be the Best Combo Of midfielder ever
Love You Lampsy… <img src="http://www.kickette.com/images/smileys/embarrassed.gif" width="19" height="19" alt="red face" style="border:0;" />
Hmmm tough one …. I agree with Fourth there's no reason why, with a little work, these two great players can't make it click, but that said I also think Barry is a must which makes for a slightly unbalanced midfield so im reserving judgement till ive seen what Capello can do with them this time. One thing I am certain of though is, Becks doesn't deserve a starting spot – go on form and pick SWP!!!!
I think Erin is right . The squad simply does'nt have enough time to gel properly cause I can't see any reason why two world class midfielders should'nt be able to work together. Becks needs to retire gracefully from international duties. And where is Owen? If I need a last minute goal I don't want to be looking at Heskey on the bench.
I have to agree, Fourth. There is no reason why Supah Frank and Stevie can't be fantabulous together. In Stevie's defense, he continuously plays where he is needed, rather than where he is most comfortable. This is something that should be worked on and perfected. Of course, I am biased toward Gerrard, but I see Lampard's talent. The easy answer would be to say that I'd prefer Lampard on the bench, but I think they need to work it out. Think if it could work– it would be incredible to behold.
Ermm Lampard Obviously, And Gerrard Cos i Cant Stand Barry Lol. And Thumbs Up!! Haha
COME ON THREE LIONS! COME ON MY LAMPSY!
Ah, good luck to England. For the midfield, I would put RM-Walcott RCM-Gerrard LCM-Barry LM-Shaun Wright-Philips or Aaron Lennon (if he feels inspired enough). I would leave Lampard out completely. There's no space on the team for a Lamps and a Gerrard. So it goes down to who's better between them and I choose Gerrard; he's compatible with most players and is the driving force behind whichever team he plays in. Lamps and Gerrard may have once worked weel together (TFO's example) but that was a long time ago and both players have changed and now are now incompatible with each other. <SPAN style="COLOR: #800080"><SPAN style="COLOR: #800080">Ramblings of a Gooner Girl</SPAN></SPAN>
thumbs up
i dont car as long as frank plays 
x
I dont care. I dont know even my name. Lampard, I love you!
I think that Fabio has to prove that he can make Lamps/Stevie work. I am not sure it can because I think the egos get in the way more then anything. If you have to pull one, you pull Stevie since Lampard is a much better squad player and is much better with being in a team formate then Gerrard is and therefore a much more consistent producer. If he is going to go with the 4-3-3 which is what has been suggested: Brown, JT/Johnson (depending on the injury), Rio, Cole, Barry, Gerrard/SWP, Lampard, Rooney, Heskey, Defoe As for the Thumbs up..I am more suprised that his tounge is not sticking out and up. Beckahm however, looks sad
I'm a liverpool fan, and I love our captain, but think Barry/Lampard is the best choice. Gerrard/Lampard never really worked, anyway their coaches didn't let Gerrard play where he wanted-on the center middle. I just can;t love England. full of most expensive Wolrd calss players, all they do is kick and rush. what would they do without Beckham's kicks? well at least their defense is good.
Stevie and Lampard *can* play together, but you can't just stick them together for a few days and a few games here and there and expect them to play a completely different set-up than they are used to. It would take real work. Can Capello accomplish that? I don't know. I guess we'll see. But I can't see leaving Gerrard out of any squad with his immense talent, so if they really can't get it together, then I think it should be Gerrard/Barry in central midfield. I also think Wright-Phillips gets the nod ahead of Beckham on the right–more threat to his game.
Gerrad and Barry *have* played very well together. That's not the sole reason for a loss when the whole team plays crap. Nor is Gerrard's absence the sole reason for a win. A + B does not equal C.
An interesting article and statistics on the Gerrard-Lampard thing: http://news.bbc.co.uk/sport2/hi/football/internat…
It's opinion, JB. You have yours, others have theirs. Nothing to get frustrated over if others don't agree with you.
Well said TammyV! =)
I just think it’s completely unreasonable that if someone thinks one should be dropped, it’s always Lampard. The last game against Croatia was probably the best the team had played in the past couple of years, and it large part it was due to Lampard’s control over the midfield. He’s playing some of the best football of his career right now, and to seat someone who’s on form is just silly. I have always thought they can play together, but am oh so very tired of people saying if they can’t it should be Frank that’s dropped. It’s not fair to someone who’s scored so many goals for both club and country (14), and who is constantly working on improving his form. He should not be so casually dismissed.
As long as Steive plays all will be well……..
in terms of pure hottness, we need all three of these lovelies in the midfield. It’s a shame we don’t have Owen these days to liven up the attacking line…
Oh, and Becks? Sorry, no.
good lordy!
I think that Fabio has to prove that he can make Lamps/Stevie work. I am not sure it can because I think the egos get in the way more then anything. If you have to pull one, you pull Stevie since Lampard is a much better squad player and is much better with being in a team formate then Gerrard is and therefore a much more consistent producer.
If he is going to go with the 4-3-3 which is what has been suggested: Brown, JT/Johnson (depending on the injury), Rio, Cole, Barry, Gerrard/SWP, Lampard, Rooney, Heskey, Defoe
As for the Thumbs up..I am more suprised that his tounge is not sticking out and up. Beckahm however, looks sad
I dont care. I dont know even my name. Lampard, I love you!
Just play Lamps. I don’t care who plays with him, but play my baby Lampsy!